Interview With ” Mr X “

~ Jerry Pippin April 2006 Interview with Mr. X

Jerry: TO THE AUDIENCE –We’re talking to a man who asked us to keep his identity
secret, because he does not want to get into trouble. He is breaking his top secret
oath because he believes we need to know what really is going between the US
Government and the UFO business. He has seen documents, spread out over
several decades. We agreed to the terms of this interview by not identifying him
and changing his voice, because we think this show is important.

Jerry: We’re out in the middle of the Mohave Desert, in the high desert, and we’re
meeting with a person who, really we cannot tell his name and we can’t give a lot of
background about him, but you’ll find out why we’re talking to this man. Can I call
you…do you prefer to be known as “Secret Man” or “Mr. X?”
Mr. X: That’s what you.…(chuckles).
Jerry: Okay, welcome to the show, by the way.
Mr. X: Thank you.
Jerry: What can you tell us, first of all, about your background?
Mr. X: Well, I worked at a southern California aerospace company for 11 years.
Jerry: While you worked there, at one time or another, you were a file clerk?
Mr. X: Well, I was on a project that was….filing documents.
Jerry: And so you had some sort of clearance, yourself?
Mr. X: Yes I did.
Jerry: And are you still in that business? Or can you say?
Mr. X: No, I’m not.
Jerry: Okay, you’re into something else now?
Mr. X: Yeah, I actually left there..
Jerry: So you actually feel that you can talk about this to a certain extent.
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: Why don’t you tell our audience exactly.…you know, we’re kind ofdancing
around here.…we need to tell them exactly what we’re talking about. What
happened there?
Mr. X: Okay, I was in a department that produced documents of some sort for the
Government.…proposals and what-not. Specification documents for spacecraft and

satellites. And so we were all cleared and we were asked to volunteer for a project.
We were asked if any of us wanted to work on a project for 6 or 8 months, and so I
said, “Yeah I’d like to,” and 4 or 5 of us volunteered. To my recollection, two of us
made it.
Jerry: So what did they do, after you volunteered, you had some sort of test or
Mr. X: No, there was no test to it, they just….
Jerry: Later they came down, who was going to do it…and it involved leaving where
you were working….at that workplace and going someplace else?
Mr. X: Yes. In near proximity though, just into another building.
Jerry: Okay.
Mr. X: And then I worked 8 –10 hours a day, inside a vaulted building, filing
Government documents.
Jerry: Now, when you say, “a vaulted building,” it’s like a safe, probably.
Mr. X: Yep. It’s exactly like that.
Jerry: When you were in there, did you have any idea about what you were going to
be doing before you got there?
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: What was your reaction when you found out what you WERE doing?
Mr. X: Oh, I was thrilled. I was thrilled, because I’d been into this my entire life and I
always knew there was “something more.”
Jerry: Now, this dealt with Roswell.
Mr. X: Well it dealt with not only that, but just Government documents in general,
about EBEs, UFO sightings and reports….
Jerry: So from the first day or so, you were involved with actually this far-out stuff?
Mr. X: Uh-huh and pictures….
Jerry: Was it all just documents you saw or did you see pictures…tell us a little bit
about it.
Mr. X: There were a lot of photographs…. there were a lot of sealed envelopes,
which was too bad for me, but….
Jerry: In the sealed envelopes…what did you do, did you make note that they were
there or something or just put them away?
Mr. X: We got a big bag every day. A bag of work. The security man brought a bag
of work in. He couldn’t even look at it. He dropped it off; then he locked the door.
And we were all in our own little room. We couldn’t talk to one another. And we
were to open these bags up and file, take out the documents and look at them, and
depending on what they were, we had special instructions and it was different every
day. It was different every day. We had different stuff every day. And it was like,
we did this work but we didn’t talk about it….
Jerry: There were how many people in this room with you?
Mr. X: There was nobody in my room.
Jerry: Okay, always by yourself.
Mr. X: Yeah, because it was like this stuff was highly classified and….
Jerry: And when you got coffee break or a lunch break, did you go out with the
Mr. X: You had to call the front desk and ask. You couldn’t leave. They brought
stuff in for you.
Jerry: You did not get to leave there at all.
Mr. X: No, they brought stuff in. They had restrooms, they fed us, they did
everything for us.
Jerry: Did they search you every day to find out if you were taking things out?
Mr. X: Most every day, but they told us every day, on a daily basis, that security was
very important.
Jerry: And you looked at this material and what was the goal? I mean, why did they
hire you to do this?
Mr. X: Well we were filing and dividing stuff up into categories.
Jerry: Do you remember the categories?
Mr. X: Some days, it was divisions of militaries. Some days it was by classification.
Sometimes it was, take the documents, take the photos, take all the sealed stuff,
take all the….you know, sometimes we had NORAD, and just all kinds of stuff. It
depended on the assignment for that day. Sometimes you got a bag of video
Jerry: If I get this correctly, you didn’t walk in and the desk was full of stuff, it was in
a sack or something you picked up?
Mr. X: No, we came to work and once we were all there, or once I was there for me,
I would call down and say, “Okay I’m here,” and they’d bring a bag up, drop it off,
and the guard would leave the room and close the door.
Jerry: Would he….was it a slot that came through the door or did he actually come
inside and leave it?
Mr. X: He came inside. Yeah. It was a huge canvas bag
Jerry: Okay, I was just trying to just get an overall picture of this.
Mr. X: It was like someone dropping off their laundry and taking off.
Jerry: Was the bag sealed?
Mr. X: It had a combination lock on it.
Jerry: And you knew the combination.
Mr. X: Yep.
Jerry: And the guard did not.
Mr. X: The guard did not. Not to my recollection.
Jerry: Or you assume he didn’t.
Mr. X: He didn’t open it..
Jerry: Right. That would be the logical thing….
Mr. X: He brought it to me closed and when I returned it, it was empty and….
Jerry: Do you remember the first thing that just knocked your socks off, that you
Mr. X: Photographs.
Jerry: What was that?
Mr. X: Photographs. I saw several of alien crafts leaving and entering the water,
with no sweat.
Jerry: Entering and leaving where?
Mr. X: The water.
Jerry: Coming out of the water.
Mr. X: Uh-Huh.
Jerry: So all the things we hear about underwater craft and these things are true?
Mr. X: I think so. Well, I saw it with my own eyes, I mean people ask me if I believe
Jerry: Were these pictures taken by….how did they get the pictures?
Mr. X: Well they were marked….I don’t know who took them, probably the military.
There were some marked Air Force, some Navy, some NORAD, some NASA, all
kinds of stuff. I mean, these particular pictures, I can’t tell you what they were
marked as or who took them.
Jerry: What did they look like, I mean the craft?
Mr. X: Just black and white disc shapes, not a real close-up picture, maybe on an 8
x 10, maybe the ship was a couple of inches across, which is, I guess pretty good
quality, but it looked just like plain…
Jerry: Did you see any documents that ever explained where these craft were
coming up from the ocean, or ‘water’ from?
Mr. X: Not to my recollection. I know that it said a few of these pictures were from
the Hawaii area.
Jerry: So that was your first thing that you saw.
Mr. X: That was the first major thing that caught my eye. I mean, there was a lot of
boring stuff in this stuff.
Jerry: So most of it probably was more or less technical stuff, it was boring and
didn’t have a lot to do with anything, as far as you were concerned.
Mr. X: Stuff to do with….a lot of stuff to do with threat to us, perceived.
Jerry: A perceived threat.
Mr. X: A perceived threat. Yeah, I don’t think that anybody was a threat.
Jerry: Why do you say that, did it say literally that this was a warning, or….
Mr. X: Well, you have to understand, I saw documents from the 1940s all the way
up through the present time, through the 1980s.
Jerry: Right, right.
Mr. X: Back in the 40s, Foo Fighters were feared, so there were documents about
national security and about what we can do, you know like the big fighter….
Jerry: Do you remember what they said about Foo Fighters?
Mr. X: A lot of stuff recommended that, it was recommended that they fire on them.
And that they don’t know where they come from but they assume that it’s otherworldly
craft and….
Jerry: Oh, they actually put that in there.
Mr. X: Uh-huh. And there were other documents that would say, “Yes, they are of
other worlds.” They are’s not a speculation. This is now true. And this….
Jerry: Did they ever explain why they came to that conclusion?
Mr. X: Because of crashes and because of other information.
Jerry: So they had recovered crashes of Foo Fighters?
Mr. X: I think that, well from the documentation I’ve seen, my guess would be
around fifty crashes, not just here, but all over the world.
Jerry: Right, I understand that. You know, my good friend Ryan S. Wood says there
were 78 or 76 or something like that, but I get the impression there’s a heck of a lot
more UFO crashes than that over the years.
Mr. X: Oh I think so too. I mean you know, Bill was surprised – Bill Ryan was
surprised –when I said 50, but….
Jerry: Speaking of Bill Ryan, did you see anything in there about Serpo?
Mr. X: Nothing. Nothing, no, that’s how I got to know him and how I got here, is that
I was on his website and I was looking at the stuff and I said, “This doesn’t jibe with
what I know.” And I got a long email back and that was kind of the way our
relationship started.
Jerry: Right, well we’re going to get into some of what you do know, because it’s
incredible and it’s.. I guess you had to sign a form that you wouldn’t tell anybody
about this, right?
Mr. X: More than one.
Jerry: What was the penalty if you did, did it say?
Mr. X: Not specifically, but I was told on numerous occasions, that the penalty for
treason is hanging.
Jerry: I’ve never understood why the Government always considered extraterrestrial
information “treasonous to our government.”Did you see some evidence in these
documents that there is an ET threat?
Mr. X: No. Well I saw no evidence to that fact.
Jerry: Well okay. That’s what I mean.
Mr. X: I mean, the fact that their capabilities are more than ours,
Jerry: Well that alone would shake up a military mind.
Mr. X: Right, but the fact that they haven’t done anything, to me is evidence that
they’re not a threat.
Jerry: Well we’re skipping around here a little bit, but I think it’s important for the
audience to understand exactly what we’re talking about. We’re talking about at
least five decades, right? Of material?
Mr. X: Oh yeah.
Jerry: And do you remember the latest item you saw….when did you….can you tell
me the year you stopped doing this?
Mr. X: About ‘84 or ’85, I think that’s when it took place.
Jerry: Okay. When you were doing….working with this material, you obviously said,
“Well I’m a file clerk when it started,” but obviously you had a secret clearance and
you had something on the ball, they believed that you were capable of doing it, I
mean they were giving you some precious, secret information for you to file
Mr. X: Uh-huh.
Jerry: Do you have any idea what happened with all this material after you filed it?
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: Do you think it’s still in that vault in that building?
Mr. X: It left the room I was in, at the end of the day. So, it was in other boxes and
Jerry: So you have no idea.
Mr. X: Nope.
Jerry: It sounds to me like they were guarding this material, as much as, you know
Brinks would gold. Probably more.
Mr. X: Well yeah.
Jerry: Okay, now let’s get back to some of the things you saw. You mentioned the
underwater craft, saucer-type craft, coming out of the water.
Mr. X: Saw several photos of a UFO craft taken from Gemini-Apollo space shuttle
Jerry: Was it a saucer craft too?
Mr. X: Some were saucers, some were just lights, looked like lights – you couldn’t
see really the shape. Obviously it’s in space, but yeah, several hundred of those.
Jerry: So all of these people, talking about, “Well we got these NASA pictures and
these satellite pictures and they show things.” They probably are onto something.
At least you saw some pictures taken by satellites….
Mr. X: Oh, yeah. Saw a lot closer, a lot more close up and better-detailed than what
they’re showing on the internet that’s supposedly this big discovery….
Jerry: Can you tell me a little bit about the detail of some of the things you
remember, I mean what do these craft look like?
Mr. X: Most of them were saucer-shaped, they looked like cigar-shaped kind of, but
then I think that’s a side view deal….
Jerry: Yeah, it could just be a matter of perspective.
Mr. X: Yeah. Most of them I saw were disc-shaped, I did see spherical items that
looked like they were unmarked, like closed spheres or glowing spheres or, but I
mean, pretty close: I’d say within between 100 and 500 feet away….
Jerry: Did the craft have any markings on them?

Mr. X: No, some of them looked like they had port-holes or windows or lights….
Jerry: Just like the general UFO reports we hear.
Mr. X: Yeah, nothing like where the door hatch would be, or anything.
Jerry: Let’s get into some of the other things. You said you saw nothing like Serpo.
Mr. X: No, I saw no information about that, whatsoever.
Jerry: Did you see evidence of any kind of extraterrestrial human-being
Mr. X: Oh, absolutely. I saw pictures.
Jerry: Tell me a little about what stands out.
Mr. X: I saw documents about biology, ETE biology. Or EBE biology, excuse me.
Jerry: Were these dead ETs and autopsy reports?
Mr. X: Autopsy documents.
Jerry: Did you see some of those pictures?
Mr. X: I saw a few pictures but I probably read more stuff than saw pictures.
Jerry: What did they say about the biology of the ETs? Was there more than one
type of species?
Mr. X: Yes, several. The most prevalent, standing out in my mind are the tall,
orange beings.
Jerry: Did you say orange?
Mr. X: Orange. Tall, orange, 7 to 8 feet, real slim. Slim like a Gray, but they have a
rounder head. The same type of eyes.
Jerry: Kind of like a devil, almost.
Mr. X: No, I wouldn’t say that.
Jerry: Or maybe like a huge guy, you know what I’m talking about right, only taller?
Mr. X: Yeah, real skinny and slim and tall, and of course there were the Grays….
Jerry: Did they tell you who they were?
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: They didn’t identify where any of these species were from?
Mr. X: Well Zeta-Reticuli was mentioned, but not as far as….
Jerry: It was. But not for that particular type being.
Mr. X: No, but what was mentioned was that the orange ones were the fathers and
creators of the Grays.
Jerry: So even the official Government documents here are either relating the ideas
of good and bad and spiritualism, etc. and evil or whatever, or maybe they’re
just….were they making those facts, or were they just saying that’s what people
Mr. X: Well some were speculation. There were a few that mentioned the Grays as
claiming to be the creators of humankind and claiming to have brought Jesus to
Jerry: Okay.
Mr. X: So there was mention of that in Government documents, both in speculation
and in what they called knowledge from the Ets themselves.
Jerry: In looking over these documents, and I want to get back to one thing at a
time, the orange ones here in a minute, but I have to ask you this, looking over
these documents, was there a lot of evidence to you –do you have any doubt at all
that we didn’t just sit down and interrogate ETs? I mean, did that happen? Did they
have conversations, in other words? There was some sort of official….
Mr. X: Oh absolutely. I did not see anything on any landing, but I did see about
mental telepathy and actual conversations.
Jerry: And the conversations, we’ll get in to in a moment. Let’s get back to the
Orange people, because that’s new to me. I hadn’t heard about the Orange people.
Mr. X: You never heard of them? There are a few people out there who know about
them.…it’s on the internet. Some of it’s out there.
Jerry: I guess I’ve seen there’s 38 species or 52 or some ungodly number, but what
I’m saying is….and there’s probably thousands really….
Mr. X: I would say so.
Jerry: Did you get the idea that all these ETs are working together or are they
separate incidents, separate encounters, in other words?
Mr. X: They’re working alongside one another, not necessarily together. I think they
have different agendas.
Jerry: What are some of those agendas, do you think?
Mr. X: Well, it’s common amongst most of them that have been in contact with our
government and other governments, that they to have a god and they do believe in
God and that they say their role is to create life here and throughout the universe.
And we’re part of that scheme. We’re part of that creation.
Jerry: Okay, so they’re basically saying that they’re going through the galaxies and
the universe, the solar systems and, what? Making sure life exists?
Mr. X: Creating life and genetically engineering beings where, let’s say, if a society
destroys themselves which is kind of where we’re headed, I believe, and that’s part
of the reason they’re here.
Jerry: Did you get the impression that, you know you talked about their being here
for some time; how about abductions? I mean, we did autopsies on them. Are they
checking us out? Have you heard….did you see anything about abductions?
Mr. X: No, no. It’s like I got this certain information….
Jerry: Right. I mean we’re not saying that it doesn’t exist or….
Mr. X: Oh I think it’s true and I think it does exist. I just don’t think that… a lot of
people are saying….
Jerry: I’ve always thought that perhaps our Government knew these abductions
were happening and we got something in return for it, whatever that is, I don’t
Mr. X: That’s what the word is out about technology….but I don’t really think they’ve
agreed….I didn’t see too much about that. I really don’t think we got much of
anything from them. I think we got a bunch of stuff that, like, “Here. Figure it out.”
Because I read about recoveries of machines and that sort of stuff from ships and I
think that stuff was sort of like.…some of the stuff that was given to us as far as
crafts and crashes and stuff I think were set up to deliberately.…
Jerry: Oh really? Why do you think that?
Mr. X: Just because of how everything happened and, I don’t know, I just got this
Jerry: That’s a personal hunch from what you’ve seen.
Mr. X: That’s a personal hunch from the stuff that I’ve read.
Jerryt: You didn’t pick up a document from anyplace that said that.
Mr. X: No, no. Absolutely not. That’s a personal feeling.
Jerry: As far as you could tell from the things you saw, were these all of the
complete documents, do you think, that existed at that time?
Mr. X: Oh, absolutely not.
Jerry: Okay. Do you know who this contract was with? Was it with the Defense
Mr. X: I have no clue. “Don’t ask any questions, don’t ask anything, just do the
Jerry: I understand that. Now, let’s get back to the other species’ pictures you saw.
These orange ones by the way, before we go any further, were they posing for
Mr. X: Some were. A lot of them were.
Jerry: Oh really? It was kinda like, “Stand still. We want to get your official picture
Mr. X: Yeah, sort of. They were like mug shots, type thing or just shots of full body
and pictures of them with Grays and…
Jerry: Could you tell if they were taken under friendly circumstances or….
Mr. X: I didn’t see any shackles or….
Jerry: Okay. No chains, nothing like that.
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: You know, we always hear about living entities like J-rod and other entities,
EBE-1 and EBE-2 and all of that. What do you make of all that? Do you think
there’s a J-rod for instance who ever existed at Los Alamos or did you see anything
from Los Alamos on that?
Mr. X: I saw pictures and stuff but just of pieces of crashes, not of him or referred to
as him. Now maybe I saw a picture of him and didn’t know who it was? Could be.
Jerry: Sure. And how about….did you see anything that you could identify that had
been at Area 51 or S-4 or whatever you want to call it?
Mr. X: White Sands stuff.
Jerry: You mean like the Tall Whites?
Mr. X: No, I don’t ever remember seeing those, I saw Oranges and Grays….
Jerry: Okay you don’t remember seeing anything like that.
Mr. X: Several of the species were like the Grays but were a little bit different.
Jerry: Other than, I guess there were some more or less human….
Mr. X: Nordics, yes.
Jerry: Yeah, Nordic types. Do you know where they’re from?
Mr. X: Saw pictures of them. No. I have no clue. The only reference to a solar
system I saw was Zeta-Reticuli.
Jerry: Now, when we talk about these things, were there any documents of threats
to the US government? I mean, I keep hearing about all the planes that we’ve lost
over the years. Is there any evidence there that planes were shot down by
extraterrestrial craft?
Mr. X: I didn’t see anything. I think it was just a fear and it was early on, you know
when the early crashes, when Roswell happened and other crashes in that time and
a lot of sightings.…Their concerns were over nuclear activity and dirty radiation. I
think that’s why that was so prevalent in World War ll.
Jerry: Now, you’re an intelligent guy, so you probably picked up, by looking at these
documents over the decades that you saw, early documents and later on closer to
the ‘80s where you were even, did theattitude of the documents change in any way,
in other words, the way they were writing about this? First what is it? Who are
these people? They’re a threat…Well they’re okay….Well we found out.…Do you get
what I mean?
Mr. X: My feeling of why they were keeping this from the people.
Jerry: Was there any document there that said why they want to keep this secret?
Mr. X: Several.
Jerry: Can you tell me some of them?

on Earth. Okay, that was the first tangible thing that I saw. It slowly went to, “This is
a Christian country and most people would go into hysteria if they knew they knew
what the truth was, if they knew that there were beings out here.”As it progressed,
and a relationship with the Government started taking place, then it’slike it’s all too
big for us to find out anything. What do we do now?
Jerry: It’s just amazing to have such incredible secrecy for this, decades later.
Mr. X: Yeah, I don’t see how they can do it, to tell you the truth.
Jerry: It seems to me that the American people or the people of the world really,
would probably be shocked for a week or two; then go on about their business. We
kind of accept everything, you know?
Mr. X: Well I think so too, and I think there’s a lot more….
Jerry: It seems to be much ado about nothing.
Mr. X: Right. There’s a lot more people, look at what’s infiltrated society with all the
alien-head stuff and all the pictures and all the skateboards, I mean it’s part of our
culture now almost and I think that’s because it’s real. You know its being real
starts in our culture. I really think the younger people would say, “Oh that’s cool.”
Jerry: Yeah.
Mr. X: “Have them come over to my house. I want to check them out.” You know?
Jerry: Well I’m not a young guy but I’d sure like to just knock on the door and say,
“Come on over here, let’s make a tape.”
Mr. X: I would too. Let’s talk. I want to know what’s out there.You show me your
world and I’ll show you mine.
Jerry: Right. Do you think we’ve gone to some other worlds?
Mr. X: I think Serpo’s true. So, yes.
Jerry: You do. But you saw no evidence in your….
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: Okay. How about Roswell?
Mr. X: Absolutely true.
Jerry: And you saw a lot of documents about Roswell?
Mr. X: And pictures, parts, and.…
Jerry: Give me some examples. We go to Roswell every year; we do lots of shows at
Roswell. Peter Jennings said Roswell was a myth. I don’t think so.
Mr. X: Well, no. Absolutely no.
Jerry: Yeah. Right.
Mr. X: Pictures of….there was like these frames, this one large picture of all these
smaller pictures of a guy taking some flat material and crushing it up into his
hands, where it was hidden? And letting it go and it going, “boing,” and springing
out and being totally creaseless. Stuff like that. I-beams with insignias on them….
Jerry: And strange writing?
Mr. X: Yep. Also, like electronic discs and stuff from crashes and like, video.
Jerry: Oh, really. In 1947 that’d have to blow their mind.
Mr. X: They probably didn’t know what it was. I don’t know that that sort of stuff
was from Roswell, but…it’s from other crashes, I would tend to believe it’s probably
further down the line.
Jerry: Was there any reason.…you know you’re talking about technically superior
people here.…they got here, or ‘creatures,’ whatever we want to call them, whatever
they want to call us, was there any reference in there about how they referred to us?
Mr. X: No, not to my recollection. No.
Jerry: Okay, I was kinda curious. I guess the official term was just “extraterrestrial
beings” or.…
Mr. X: Extraterrestrial biological entities. EBEs….
Jerry: Right, we have that part of it right, then.
Mr. X: Oh yeah, or Grays or they call them by.…I mean there’s a mention of, people
ask me….or Bill asked me, I guess, if I had seen anything about reptilians and I said,
“No.” Nothing in the documentation I looked at, and that seems to be why they
don’t believe that those exist. Now they could’ve.
Jerry: Right, as you said you didn’t have all the documents probably, but of the
documents you saw, that’s what we’re zeroing in on here.
Mr. X: Exactly. And if that’ small or large, I don’t know how big a part it was.…
Jerry: Was there ever any discussion on why these extraterrestrials would crash?
Why the UFOs would crash?
Mr. X: Well there was one where they had figured that the craft was downed by
good, old-fashioned radar. Good, old-fashioned radar messed up their system.
Jerry: So, the really hot radar back in those years.
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: So we more or less have that story right.
Mr. X: Yeah. I mean it’s like, their technology’s so advanced, they don’t think
about.…they don’t use the radio waves….
Jerry: Do you know if they had any survivors to that crash?
Mr. X: To the Roswell crash?
Jerry: Yeah.
Mr. X: Yeah, one.
Jerry: And you saw some evidence of that?
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: And how severely injured was that creature? I mean what’d they do
with….where would you take a creature that’s injured, I wonder?
Mr. X: To an Army base or some kind of Navy base or something.…
Jerry: You don’t know which one.
Mr. X: I don’t know, no. But I do know that they did have one and he was pretty
badly hurt. It wasn’t like he could just walk away. Or she.
Jerry: Did he recover or do you know?
Mr. X: No. He died three or four days later.
Jerry: Was there any evidence of other.… You know, in the military when you lose
somebody, you go after the body if you can get it. Is there any evidence the ETs do
Mr. X: No. No, they regard their bodies a little different than we do. Their body’s a
shell. They’re spiritual like we are, but they….and this is from government
documents from their communications with us. That their body is a shell and when
they die they leave their body and they’re conscious of it, they’re conscious when
they’re gone and they get a new body and they don’t ever forget. They like, don’t
die. Where we go and have an out-of-body experience or “go to the light” or
whatever? And we forget where we were and….
Jerry: They remember.
Mr. X: They don’t ever forget when they die. Yeah, they say we live many lives and
choose other lives and we go out and cruise space for a while and come back and
decide that we want to live again and go inside another body. We’re learning.
Jerry: Are there two different sexes?
Mr. X: Yes. But they don’t…they don’t really ah….procreate like we do. They just
make bodies and recycle the biological material.
Jerry: Well, frankly that doesn’t sound as much fun as the way we do it but that’s
beside the point.
Jerry: You said the extraterrestrials, at least these that you read about, did not reproduce the way
we do, we’re talking about a sexual way but more of a spiritual or scientific way, by
entering a body –a new body prepared for them. Now this brings up the thing that
I’m wondering. I’ve heard about male and female ETs before, so the question here
really is, are there two different sexes for ETs, male and female?
Mr. X: Yeah. But they don’t really procreate like we do. They just make bodies and
recycle biological material.
Jerry: How does that work?
Mr. X: I would imagine they do something in the lab or something in a culture.
Jerry: They’re probably cloned.
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: Did you see any evidence of that in the documents?
Mr. X: Quotes and stuff, yeah. Written down, documentation….
Jerry: Do you remember the first time that you saw a document where, I imagine it
would be a military officer, talked to an extraterrestrial?
Mr. X: Uh-huh.
Jerry: Do you remember where that was?
Mr. X: I remember “Air Force” on the documents.
Jerry: There was a language problem there, wasn’t there or was it all telepathic?
Mr. X: It was mostly telepathic. And they knew they could think to us in English.
Jerry: And then when they were in another country they would think to them in their
Mr. X: Yeah. Because they know what’s going on here.
Jerry: We don’t have evidence, or maybe we do, that’s what I’m going to ask you, do
they prefer certain countries on the Earth?
Mr. X: Well….

Jerry: Or do different races go different places? I did a story recently with Wendelle
Stevens, in which he talked about a particular extraterrestrial race that he thought
preferred Germans. Nazis. And it goes back to the Foo Fighter days and before
that, and when he was at Wright Patterson Air Force Base in 1947 he threw away a
lot of evidence, not by malice….[but from] ignorance; he didn’t know what it was.
He just thought it was strange writing and pitched it. And then later on he figured
out there was a German connection. So the Foo Fighters were definitely extraterrestrial

and that’s where he was leaving his conversation.

Mr. X: Well that’s what they used to call them. They don’t use that term any more
obviously. Because they thought they were a threat. They thought they were from
another country. There was Germany and Russia.…they didn’t know where they
came from. They thought these were secret weapons.
Jerry: You can understand some of the things that we did, top-secret-wise when the
Cold War was on and World War ll was on, but I’m not so sure that there’s any
threat like that now. I don’t think anybody’s going to get on a camel and take an ET,
you know what I mean?
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: So we don’t have a threat like that now.
Mr. X: It was done out of ignorance and it was innocent ignorance, not..
Jerry: What really jumps out at you, I mean this has been several years back, that
you saw these documents.…If you had an overall message of these documents that
you saw, what would it be? That there’s nothing to fear?
Mr. X: Nothing to fear from them, but they’re concerned about us.
Jerry: They think we’re more dangerous than they are, huh?
Mr. X: More dangerous to ourselves.
Jerry: Well I can’t argue with that.
Mr. X: You know, like dirty radiation. There are two real major issues they now have
with us….and this will be the Grays….is that we’re gaining the capability to travel
interplanetarily (sic) and enter different solar systems. Between other solar systems
and we’re attracted to dirty radiation….bombs, engines, whatever it is….not clean
radiation, and their fear is that not only are we going to destroy ourselves. Number
Two, that we could take it somewhere else.
Jerry: And actually cause….
Mr. X: Damage and pollution somewhere else and that’s.…
Jerry: Let’s talk a little bit about some particular incidents that you remember. You
said they had two sexes, male and female, I imagine.
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: But they don’t procreate; they’re not dating.
Mr. X: No. Some are. I mean some, they are together but they don’t….they are
companions. They don’t have to have sex to procreate; they can get a new body….
Jerry: I wonder if they show affection at all. They probably don’t have to. It’s
probably just a mental, emotional thing.
Mr. X: Well they’re beings. Maybe even if it’s “thought affection,” I would think it
would be….
Jerry: That’s what I’m saying. They may have progressed beyond actual the actual
physical part of it…. Do you have any idea how they get from huge distances to
here? Was there any information in there like.…”We just don’t understand the way
Mr. X: That’s pretty much what it was. Talk about bending space and bringing….you
don’t go there, you bring them here. That sort of stuff, where you create a vacuum
in distance, a distance vacuum, and you bring whatever you want to get to you, to
you, and it’s like it’s shorter outside the craft than inside.
Jerry: Hmm.
Mr. X: From inside, it takes them a while to get here but outside, it’s fast.
Jerry: Instantaneous.
Mr. X: Close to it. Not exactly, but close to it. Within minutes to get from here to
there, where there might be 40 light-years….whatever….
Jerry: And there’s some evidence that some of these craft shot lasers out or light
beams or whatever. Anything in there like that?
Mr. X: Light beams there, but I’ve never heard of them destroying anything.
Jerry: You never saw anything where a fighter plane was shot down that was
attacking them?
Mr. x: No, I’ve seen them….seen documents about disabling the instrumentation in
aircraft and aircraft crashing, but only because they were chasing, but nothing to
destroy….just like, to prevent.
Jerry: So basically, you saw absolutely no evidence of them being a threat to us.
Mr. X: Absolutely not.
Jerry: Just the other way around.
Mr. X: Correct.
Jerry: We were trying to shoot them down….which we were at one time.
Mr. X: Which we can’t.
Jerry: Right. We figured out, we can’t. I don’t think they even try to do it any more.
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: And you saw evidence of them working together, maybe not in unison, but
they were aware of each other.
Mr. X: Correct.
Jerry: Would that be kind of a “United Nations of the Galaxies” or something?
Mr. X: I liken it most to the Prime Directive of Star Trek.
Jerry: It seems to me that Star Trek is right-on about a lot of things.
Mr. X: Absolutely. Absolutely.
Jerry: Do you have any theory about that? How that happened?
Mr. X: I think there are beings that “make it” long enough and evolve enough to
realize that we’re all the same “being.” Everybody on Earth, there are so many
races and all that stuff but our souls are the same and that we need to get it all
together and.…
Jerry: I want to get back to the ET biology.
Mr. X: Okay.
Jerry: Do they have stomachs?
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: How do they eat?
Mr. X: Their blood is chlorophyll-based. So they’re a plant-animal. They don’t eat.
They absorb sunlight and use carbon dioxide.
Jerry: Unless their structure is totally different from ours, they have to have some
sort of energy.
Mr. X: Yeah, they get minerals and stuff from the atmosphere and from.…
Jerry: They absorb it.
Mr. X: Uh-huh. Through their skin.
Jerry: So nobody sits down and orders a steak.
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: They must look upon us, having to eat three meals a day, rather quizzically.
Mr. X: The worst part of it is the aftermath, the waste. I mean it’s like a plant has
no waste. It has waste – its waste is what we live off of: it’s oxygen.
Jerry: So in other words, they don’t have bowel movements or anything like that.
Mr. X: No, not that I’m aware of. Their esophagus goes down to a point and that’s
Jerry: Do some of them actually have voices do you think?
Mr. X: Yeah, I would think so. Not a lot about that. A lot about thought communication.
Jerry: What’s your feeling right now. Do you think there’s ETs among us, talking to
some Colonel or General right now someplace?
Mr. X: I think so. I think there are different kinds. A lot of different kinds. And I
think in other nations too.
Jerry: Do you think any President’s ever met an ET?
Mr. X: I would say Truman and Eisenhower probably. I don’t think anybody else.
Jerry: You didn’t see any documents to that effect, though.
Mr. X: No. But I would….
Jerry: You didn’t see the famous Edwards Air Force document where Ike went there
and they met him on the runway or anything.
Mr. X: No. No.
Jerry: Did you see anything like that? Anything that they were going to have a
meeting or a treaty or agreement or….
Mr. X: Just stuff about acquired equipment.
Jerry: Required equipment?
Mr. X: Acquired equipment. Machines..
Jerry: Okay. In other words, what we found in crashes.
Mr. X: Right. Or what’s given to us: “Here, take this.”
Jerry: And of course you worked for aerospace company, right? So that may have
been all the material they were giving you guys because that’s what you’d be
interested in….your company.
Mr. X: Could be. Could be that that’s the documents that I happened to see or that
were passed across my desk to be filed.
Jerry: You know, this has been an incredible time, and just mind-boggling when we
start talking about it and I know you’ve thought about it for a long time now, over
and over and over. What conclusions do you draw here? I mean, there’s life on
other worlds. We agree to that, right?
Mr. X: Absolutely.
Jerry: And as far as you know they’re not into physically threatening us. They’re not
eating us for lunch.
Mr. X: No. They’re coming here though, a lot of them are coming here….
Jerry: And why don’t you think they want an official notice that they’re here?
Mr. X: It’s coming. It’s coming within 5 or 6 years. Because that was mentioned:
2012, and visitations.
Jerry: And did it say what this visitation would consist of?

Mr. X: That they would make themselves known to the human race through landing
and through our massive communication network. And, if there was nuclear war
before that time that they could possibly intervene.
Jerry: In other words, if we didn’t wait until 2012, because we’re going to blow
ourselves up, they would intervene.
Mr. X: Yes.
Jerry: I’ve done a lot of shows about UFO intervention with missiles. A lot of people
were on duty when these things happened.
Mr. X: Yeah. They shut them down.
Jerry: Yeah. Did you see anything like that?
Mr. X: I saw documents to that effect, yeah.
Jerry: You did see documents to that effect.
Mr. X: Disabling nuclear missiles and shutting off hundreds of silos and…
Jerry: So basically you really feel, after seeing these documents that probably
they’re not going to let us destroy ourselves.
Mr. X: I think they’re going to let a lot of us die, but not all of us.
Jerry: Why would they let some of us die, do you think?
Mr. X: Well, you’re really not dying, Number One. Your bodies are being
destroyed….your souls are still alive. So….
Jerry: So they have souls and we have souls. Do these souls intermingle?
Mr. X: Yeah, upon death. We can go up to one of them. I don’t know that you can
tell the difference. But that’s just personal opinion.
Jerry: I understand that. And you did see documents – official US Government
documents that dealt with this subject.
Mr. X: Yes. That dealt with recycling of bodies and this whole thing about not dying
and not understanding physical pain because they don’t have physical pain. They
can cut their arm and….
Jerry: They don’t have any pain?
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: And there are documents to that effect?
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: Be pretty tough to defeat them in a war then, wouldn’t it?
Mr. X: There is no winner.
Jerry: Well, do you think some people in our government think they can?
Mr. X: Yeah. I think some people in our government think they can control
humanity and keep things the way they are, here.
Jerry: When this thing about 2012….was that date given?
Mr. X: Uh-huh.
Jerry: It actually was given.
Mr. X: December 21st or 22nd.
Jerry: What we’ve talked about before.
Mr. X: Same old thing everybody else talks about, the Mayan Calendar.…
Jerry: It keeps coming back, right. Now, who’s coming? Did it say a group of them
or just one group or did it go into detail?
Mr. X: The Grays are what it talked about so I would imagine it’s probably them.
Because they say that they put us here.
Jerry: So we’re really….as far as the Grays are concerned, we’re kind of their stepchildren.
Mr. X: Yeah. We’re their children. They care about us and we’re part of….we’re a
project for them. We’re part of the life that they put on Earth. And there are other
beings like us on other planets throughout the universe.
Jerry: Other human-type….
Mr. X: Yeah, not exactly but maybe have a different color skin but have the same
evolutionary process.
Jerry: As far as you know you didn’t see anything about Serpo but you think there’s
truth to it.
Mr. X: Yeah I think that, I don’t know, there’s so much the detail in it, it’s not what
I’m concerned about; it’s the whole concept. And yes, I do think so. I mean there
are so many things that are like, “Close Encounters of the Third Kind.” There’s a
movie I saw when I was young. And this was before I was working in aerospace,
that to me, is pretty close to the truth and that’s, “Hangar 18.” I don’t know if you’ve
ever seen that movie. It’s cheesy. It’s like a parallel to the Roswell crash but it’s
about a space shuttle that launches a satellite and hits a UFO and it crashes to
Jerry: We haven’t talked about cattle mutilations because we’ve been talking about
the goodness of the extraterrestrial movement and you’ve been pretty explicit about
it and you have documentation to back it up. But how do you explain that part of it?
Mr. X: The cattle mutilations?
Jerry: Did they deal at all in cattle mutilations? Did you see any documents about
Mr. X: I saw documents about that but never anything that would mark them as
sinister and from the ETs. They wondered what it was and there were UFO sightings
around those times. So I think there’s a correlation there but I don’t think there was
anything else.
Jerry: Did they write about Bigfoot?
Mr. X: No. No Loch Ness type stuff, none of that.
Jerry: Okay, no Bigfoot, no monsters, and no reptilians.
Mr. X: No reptilians. Not come across my desk.
Jerry: I’ve often felt that, not only in the Christian religion, but in many religions,
especially the things that were written two, three thousand, four thousand years
ago, that there could have been an extraterrestrial element to it and that mankind
at that point just wouldn’t understand it. Yet the extraterrestrials, you said earlier
that they did believe in a divine God.
Mr. X: Yes.
Jerry: Did they believe in a singular godhead?
Mr. X: Yes.
Jerry: And did they call him God? Or did they call it a “force?”
Mr. X: We referred to what they believed in as “God,” but no mention of what they
called him or “it” or what they thought it was..
Jerry: In other words, as far as they were concerned, it might be as simple as what
we saw in some of the movies: “May the Force be with you,” kind of thing.
Mr. X: Or it could have been their collective consciousness as a set of souls.
Jerry: And they really dealt in reincarnation and they really believe in that.
Mr. X: They manufactured bodies, so yeah they kind of just think….
Jerry: They manufactured what?
Mr. X: They manufactured bodies to use when they needed them, when their body’s
worn out.
Jerry: So you’re saying there’s a factory in the sky someplace where they say, “Hey
Joe, we’ve got a thousand souls today coming about. We need bodies?”
Mr. X: Well no, the biological entities themselves had their own laboratory and
made their own bodies. Their quote was “They recycled bodies.”
Jerry: In other words, they chose who they were going to be next?
Mr. X: Yeah, they were pretty much all the same. There was no.…
Jerry: So the eternal, everlasting life – with them was not a mystery, it’s a fact.
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: How long do these bodies they have right now, last? Did they say?
Mr. X: Three to four hundred years.
Jerry: And do they go check into a hospice or someplace?
Mr. X: I’m not sure how they do it.
Jerry: I mean I wonder how they do that.
Mr. X: I think they just walk into the lab and do an EBE out-of-body experience, an
OBE and….
Jerry: You think it’s that fast? Is there any evidence that Grays are androids? You
hear about that a lot.
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: You think they’re entities, huh?
Mr. X: Yeah, oh I know they are.
Jerry: All of them.
Mr. X: Well what I learned about. I didn’t see anything about any kind of androids
or “part machine” or.…
Jerry: We’ve said some fairly earth-shaking things to people. I’ve been doing shows
like this for four decades and you saw all these secret documents, so it may not be
earth-shaking to you or me, but for the normal person out there, we’ve pretty well
skirted heresy here. What do you say to those people?
Mr. X: Well, there’s a lot more happening than you realize. The world isn’t always
what you see and what you’re taught. Just be careful who you listen to and….
Jerry: Do you have any evidence where they voluntarily come and stay, like you
know we hear about the story…I did a show recently, with the Aviary, in which they
talked about EBE 3 being a female ambassador. And being in a safe-house near
Washington, DC and they tried to make contact with her and they weren’t able to do
it but they almost did. But Reagan, according to their story, did see the EBE 3, the
female ambassador. Did you see anything like that in these documents? Yours
were more just crash….
Mr. X: Crash and then….
Jerry: Well you did have some interrogations though.
Mr. X: Uh-huh. A little bit but more just the informational type and reports and,
“This is what we think.” And, “This is what we know.” More of it was, “What we
Jerry: You never saw in any of these documents, where a crash, extraterrestrial that
we recovered or one that we met or captured, or they came willingly or however it
happened, where they said something like, “According to the Geneva Convention I
don’t have to tell you anything.” They were cooperative, in other words.
Mr. X: To a certain extent. I think they told us what we could handle.
Jerry: You know they gave more than their name, rank, and serial number.
Mr. X: Right. They’re dealing with the Government. They’re not dealing with a
normal person that might be more open-minded. They’re dealing with somebody
whose mindset is, “protect, control, and own.”
Jerry: But as far as you could see, from the relationships, the little bit of stuff you
saw about relationships, it more or less was a cooperative effort. There was not any
animosity on either side.
Mr. X: No, not at all, no. In fact, when we recovered their bodies after the crashes,
they didn’t ever come back to get them. They could care less. Because they didn’t
have anything when they had the bodies, according to the EBEs, they were like, “So I
don’t have a body. I’ll just get a new one. It’s no big deal.”
Jerry: So how did they look at our attitude…you know, our attitude is, we have to
recoup that body, so….
Mr. X: No, they don’t see it like we do. That’s what I think a lot of people don’t
understand, because they look at it in terms of human and it’s hard to look past
that because that’s what we are. They don’t look at it as, you know, that it’s
possible that other people can have other values.
Jerry: If I get what you are saying here, in 2012, December 20th, 21st, whatever the
date is, there’s going to be a lot of ships land. CNN or all the television networks will
be broadcasting it. We’ll all know about it. And is it basically, “We’re here!.” Is that
the way they plan to do it?
Mr. X: Yeah, and we’ll be given choices.
Jerry: And the choice is what?
Mr. X: That if we want to learn where they came from and to learn to evolve more
spiritually so we too, can go throughout the universe and make life.
Jerry: You know many, many governments and some religions, will not accept that.
They will say, “Yeah, they’re telling you that but what they’re wanting to do is make
you their slaves. They’re controlling your life.”
Mr. X: Yeah, I think that the Government will say, “This is our Christiannation and
they’re Satan and it’ll be that whole thing, that whole duality where you choose us
or them.”
Jerry: It appears to me that our Government is not doing us a favor by keeping us in
the dark.
Mr. X: Correct. I agree, 100 percent.
Jerry: And it does appear to me that I’m getting more information these days from
official sources, not high, high up but higher up than before. It’s almost like part of
the Government wants us to know.
Mr. X: Yeah.

Jerry: They feel like you do.
Mr. X: I can see now it’s slowly coming out.
Jerry: 2012 might be wonderful for a lot of people. A lot of people might say, “Hey!
This is the ‘Rapture’.” You know. Some other people will say, “Hey, they’re coming
to get us.” And other people will be saying….I mean, I can see it a very confusing
Mr. X: I would think so too. It’s because of how we’re taught. If we’re taught devout
Christianity or if you’re taught any other religion it’s all looked at differently. It’s all
looked at differently.
Jerry: Did you see anything in the documents you did, about the moon? Us going to
the moon and never going back? Did they act like they had bases up there or
Mr. X: I didn’t see anything, no.
Jerry: Okay. So basically it seems to me that when you really get down to it, the
Government probably doesn’t know a whole lot more than we do. Or do you think
they know a lot more and they just don’t want to tell us.
Mr. X: I would think they know more and they don’t want to tell us, I don’t know if
it’s a lot more. I think there’s enough information out there and enough people.…
Jerry: And what do you think that is, that they know the races of the
extraterrestrials and where they’re from? Is that what we’re talking about?
Mr. X: That and their capabilities are more and that we can have these capabilities
too. They have a lot of technology. The Government has a lot of technology….like,
we don’t need oil right now. There is no reason for us to use oil. We have plenty of
secret projects that have technology way beyond that.
Jerry: Did you ever see any documents on what energy the extraterrestrials used?
Was it a zero plus energy base or something?
Mr. X: Not that I can remember, just that it’s not like anything we have.
Jerry: Well it’s good to hear we don’t need gasoline, at $3.25 and $3.35 a gallon
out here in the desert.
Mr. X: It’s because people want money you know, I think that’s what it’s about
Jerry: It seems to me that maybe the evil should be spread about a little bit more
than just the Government wanting to keep a secret, maybe there’s a lot of corporate
interest here too.
Mr. X: Oh I think so. I think it all has….it’s all tied together.
Jerry: What do you think the answer’s going to be? We only have six years, if your
prediction’s right.
Mr. X: Well yeah, the answer’s going to be.…the big problem is going to be all the
turmoil. People are given the opportunity to learn who they really are and where
they came from and…,
Jerry: In the worst-case scenario, you see huge amounts of death.
Mr. X: Yeah, mass hysteria. Absolutely.
Jerry: Do you see this Earth being shrunk from being from six and a half billion
maybe to the Neocons say, a half a billion.
Mr. X: Yeah. A half to one [billion] I think.
Jerry: So that may happen.
Mr. X: Uh-huh. And different parts of the world will be differently affected. I think
countries like India where they are more spiritual and less….where the religions are
more spiritual and less controlling…. I think they’ll fare better.
Jerry: So the disaster will be controlled, in other words in your mind, the Earth is
probably a fairly good prize and the ETs won’t let us destroy that.
Mr. X: No.
Jerry: We might destroy each other.
Mr. X: Yeah if we destroy each other, they’ll probably just put more beings on the
Earth. And probably different ones.
Jerry: Really? Did you see any discussions about that?
Mr. X: About?
Jerry: Well I mean the Grays seem to think that we’re their creation, one way or the
other, and I don’t want to get into the technical part of it or religion and who created
who, but they think that they had a big part in it.
Mr. X: Yeah, we’re a cross between….they’re the missing link.
Jerry: Did they have documents that said, “Hey, we made a mistake. We should
have done something else here?”
Mr. X: No, because it’s all part of the plan. I think we’re just simply….if we’re not
evolved enough to take care of ourselves and survive, then we destroy ourselves
and they find someplace else or some other beings to cross with them to make
something else.
Jerry: So in summary, you’ve seen documents where actually extraterrestrials exist.
Mr. X: Yes.
Jerry: And lots of saucers and other craft and you haven’t seen any evidence of any
Mr. X: No. Just our shooting at them or pursuing them but nothing shooting back.
Jerry: And you haven’t seen any evidence that they’re going to destroy us, but they
may let us do part of the job.
Mr. X: Yeah.
Jerry: What’s the message? What can we do about it?
Mr. X: I don’t think there’s a whole heck of a lot we can do about it. It’s just.…
Jerry: Just tighten your seat belts and go for the ride?
Mr. X: Yeah, unless more people with information come out and talk. I think it’s
imperative that people that are in the know tell the truth.
Jerry: I appreciate your taking the time to talk to me.
Mr. X: It’s been a pleasure.
Jerry: Okay thank you.

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